It hasn't been a good few months for the Exchange product team at Microsoft. First the Outlook team ships an updated connector for Lotus Domino; then they dismantle their own roadmap; and now they are facing internal competition:
"Our first product here is going to be using Outlook that uses the Hotmail e-mail infrastructure. So you don't need to have an Exchange Server if you're a small business; you can just use Hotmail and you can have that synchronized experience, as well as the calendaring and everything else with other people who are on Hotmail."I suppose some could see this as a defensive move against the low-end "good enough" mail servers, especially on Linux, but it also erodes the Exchange base -- at the end of the deployment spectrum where Exchange has its strongest presence. What could be driving this, I wonder aloud....perhaps Exchange+Windows 2003+Office 2003 is too costly/complicated for low-end SMB customers to deploy?
Link: eWeek: Microsoft readies new hosted services for SMB >
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- 2
Axel Janssen | 7/9/2004 4:00:25 AM
Hi Ed,
talking about low end SMB customers. Why shouldn't they use open Source groupware solutions like:
- http://www.hipergate.org/about/
- http://www.phproject.de/
- http://www.phproject.de/features.php
In a non-vile and civilized manner I am sincerely interested in the opinion of you as Marketing Manager of Lotus.
kind regards Axel
- 3
Nathan T. Freeman | 7/9/2004 4:54:42 AM
*cough*WorkplaceMessaging*cough*
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Carl http://www.iminstant.com | 7/9/2004 5:46:23 AM
My first thought was Kettle, pot, black.
You don't think Workplace Messaging can erode eroding Domino installs? Sure the magic box will only show it getting "factory shop floor workers" but we all know in realty IBMers are try to sell that to any and everyone. One key difference with the MS approach is that they are pushing the same client experience, no need to retrain users when you Mr. SMB become an enterprise etc. etc.
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| 7/9/2004 5:47:06 AM
oops. Almost alters the whole sentence.
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Travis J Retzlaff | 7/9/2004 6:51:42 AM
With the MS solution hosted Exchange providers will end up losing business to MS & Hotmail. I don't see this being as much of a problem with Workplace. There is one reason whey IBM's strategy is easier to swallow. Secondly they are providing new componentized plug and play type of functionality with Workplace in addition to the server managed client model. This is a good thing. Not just hey it's the same old Outlook with a different back end, blah... There's MS and it's lack of ability to innovate again.
Here IBM has a strategy that seems to be focused on serving the needs of the SMB community and they get knocked for it. A day or two ago the complaint was that IBM disregards the SMB community. Guess you can't please all of the people all of the time. I'd sure hate to be in marketing....
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Peter Xu | 7/9/2004 7:48:52 AM
I think IBM has also gone to same direction with Workplace messaging facing internal competition with Lotus but mitive is to offer Low Cost solution where both IBM and MS gearing towards !!!
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Ed Brill www.edbrill.com | 7/9/2004 8:00:01 AM
Two reasons why --
1) Lotus Workplace Messaging is still targeted at large scale deployments. It is in the vein of different users/different needs, but it's fully interoperable with Domino (can be provisioned from Domino, will interoperate with Domino calendaring, etc.).
2) The SALES model is completely different from what MS is talking about. Let's put it this way -- MS is not likely to put any salespeople on quota to sell Hotmail as a back-end for Outlook -- whereas obviously they do for Exchange. IBM have sellers focused on the entire Lotus portfolio, offering the right SOLUTION for the customer's need. Also, Workplace messaging is not just being offered as a stand-alone product. It is part of the Workplace PLATFORM, and thus an integrated component of the entire offering.
The 1.0 release of Lotus Workplace Messaging was only targetted at underserved/unserved users. The 1.1 release added calendaring. The 2.0 release added group scheduling. IBM is building up the functionality and integration with Notes/Domino.
In the MS example cited, the Outlook/Hotmail users have no directory interoperability with corporate mail systems, no calendar interoperability, etc, and the system runs off-site. So sorry, it's not at all the same.
- 9
Ed Brill www.edbrill.com | 7/9/2004 8:05:12 AM
I would more think of the Notes Express/Domino Express offerings as being IBM's lead offering for SMB messaging/collaboration these days.
Workplace Messaging is designed as low-cost, <b>highly scalable</b> mail. It's not targetted at a company with 50 employees, and we've never said that it was.
Last thought on that topic, both Workplace Messaging and Notes/Domino are LOTUS products, run by the very same team. There's no internal competition when the management over both offerings is 90% the same.
As to Axel's question about the other generic POP/IMAP mail servers and how IBM is differentiated, I have always maintained that there is a full spectrum of needs in the messaging market. Those mail servers are the Motel 6/Red Roof Inns of the messaging market -- clean and basic. For a company that sees value in collaboration, Lotus provides more complete and compelling solutions.
- 10
Douglas Himmler | 7/9/2004 8:09:28 AM
"Here IBM has a strategy that seems to be focused on serving the needs of the SMB community"
How many SMB's do you work with that are willing to learn Websphere Application Server, DB2 and Websphere Portal Server to run Workplace Messaging?
- 11
Heini | 7/9/2004 9:03:18 AM
A scaled down version of Workplace would work.
Unfortunately IBM is very calm if you ask in that direction.
- 12
Nathan T. Freeman | 7/9/2004 9:16:28 AM
It's still the same in terms of confusing customers, Ed. Microsoft is just confusing a different segment of the market than Lotus is.
Why would you expect your customers to care, by the way, whether Workplace Messaging and Domino have 90% of the same management and salespeople? Who cares what Lotus' internal incentive plan is? What matters is: how do they identify what the solution is for their future needs, just like MS customers are going to ask the same question.
Has it occured to you that if MS offers a migration path from their hosted service to a company's own Exchange environment, they can offer a really interesting continuous spectrum service from the 1-man operation up to enterprise levels? (Or at least as enterprise as Exchange can get.) Is there ANY offering from Lotus that matches that? (that's a rhetorical question, of course.) MS is looking at a really interesting value proposition for long-term relationships with a customer here. I don't think it's something to chuckle about.
- 13 Travis J Retzlaff | 7/9/2004 10:07:30 AM
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Ed Brill www.edbrill.com | 7/9/2004 10:17:25 AM
especially since you were defending my core position ;) Over time, we might see that Workplace Messaging can be offered in SMB as much as Notes/Domino plays there today.
- 15
Steve http://radio.weblogs.com/0135175/ | 7/9/2004 7:08:04 PM
in public at least. I posted a link to your post, and some background I had posted on a simillar topic as well.
http://radio.weblogs.com/0135175/2004/07/10.html#a159
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Paul Robichaux http://www.e2ksecurity.com | 7/13/2004 12:20:50 PM
So, if Workplace Messaging isn't the same kind of thing, what about Domino Express?
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Ed Brill http://www.edbrill.com/ebrill/edbrill.nsf/dx/07132004042920PMEBRS2D.htm | 7/13/2004 3:56:06 PM
Yes, Express is an SMB play -- and it's exactly the same code as Notes/Domino.
http://www.peterdehaas.com/2004/07/ed-brill-on-eweeks-microsoft-readies.html