eWeek: IBM, Ubuntu Cloud Collaboration Package Seeks to Cut Down Microsoft Windows 7
October 20 2009
IBM and Canonical ramp up the message around the client for Smart Work...
Citing recent Gartner research that said migration to Windows 7 could cost businesses around $2,000 per user due to new PC requirements, IBM said its Client for Smart Work package is geared to help companies save up to 50 percent per seat on software costs versus a Microsoft-based desktop. This is because the solution lets companies run a combination of Web-based applications and Linux on their existing PCs, netbooks and thin clients. ...Good quotes in the article from Forrester analyst Sheri McLeish as well.
IBM Lotus General Manager Bob Picciano got his licks in: "If a company is a 'Windows shop,' at some point it will need to evaluate the significant costs of migrating its base to Microsoft's next desktop and bolstering its defenses against virus and other attacks."
Other coverage visible on Bob Sutor's blog.
Link: eWeek: IBM, Ubuntu Cloud Collaboration Package Seeks to Cut Down Microsoft Windows 7 >
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- 2
Tripp Black http://www.mindwatering.com | 10/20/2009 7:11:31 PM
Overall, I agree. However, most people are used to what they are used to - it takes a push and time.
Here's our personal story...
We are a small Notes shop (<15 users) and it has taken YEARS.
In 1998, Lotus Notes replaced Outlook for us because of the Notes and web apps. We started with 2 R5 servers, one for mail and one for apps. We swapped our old IIS web sites and ASP code for the Domino database and Notes agent.
We converted one of the two Lotus Domino mail/app servers to run on Redhat 7 and took the dive into Linux for our servers. Now it's on RH 5.2 or 5.3.)
With Sametime Entry being included, we were stuck with our second server on Windows until ST was released for Linux. By that time, all of our servers except a Mac XServe were now running Linux.
With VI 3, we converted the bulk of our servers to VMs. Except for client servers, we have no Windows servers, until this past week. Traveler runs only on Windows. So we took a XP classroom VM, cloned it and installed Domino and Traveler.
On the client side, we were exclusively Windows with the exception of one Mac user and the Mac server. After testing Vista, we shelved it for the memory consumption and usability issues. With needing to spend $600-$800 upgrading PCs, we decided to revaluate.
We deployed Notes Basic (or Standard with the run as Basic Flag) on several machines. As we are a music and graphic shop, a conversion to Apple made sense for us despite the laptop cost. We made that leap with the Mac 8.5 Beta program and shortly following Symphony Beta on Mac. We have 2 PCs migrated to Ubuntu and will either deploy Ubuntu or Mac (Mac Mini) on all the rest over the next 2 years except one machine - mine. I have to run Windows for the Designer client.
As for Linux for users, the client experience was dismal and crude until Ubuntu. Obviously I am now biased towards Ubuntu as it has the most user-friendly GUI and the least configuration issues. It also has the paid support from Canonical which is nice (although we haven't had to call it yet. The forums are good.) With Thunderbird (or Gnome Evolution), you have a better mail client than Outlook Express especially with its Tracker indexing enabled. With Lotus Notes on Ubuntu, you have an Enterprise environment that is stable and can run on current P4/duel core 1.5-2GB PC hardware.
The last hold out some of our clients was the ALT-F11 VB feature in Word & Excel. With Lotus Symphony adding VBScript support, there should be some serious evaluation for replacement Excel and Word. As for us, we divorced ourself as COM for the most part over the last couple years as we've transition to Ubuntu and the Mac OS X.
- 3
Mike Brown http://www.browniesblog.com | 10/20/2009 7:44:06 PM
@Ed,
It would be nice if we could see some screen shots of what the thing actually looks like.
Cheers,
- Mike
- 4
Mike Brown http://www.browniesblog.com | 10/20/2009 7:59:12 PM
@2,
You said it, Tony. Let's see.
Ubuntu: modest system requirements
Windows 7: huge system requirements, and can't be run (unless you're *asking* for trouble) without anti-virus software, which takes resources of its own
Ubuntu: Good security, built-in from the start
Windows 7: Swiss-cheese security, added as an afterthought
Ubuntu: No viruses to speak of
Windows 7: viruses coming out of your ears
Ubuntu: zero purchase costs
Windows 7: bloody expensive. Also incurs costs for anti-virus.
Ubuntu: regular release schedule - every 6 months, or every 2 years for LTS (Long Term Support) versions. Only one version of Ubuntu, 6.06, has *ever* missed that schedule.
Windows: haphazard release schedule, anywhere from 3 to 5 years. Impossible to predict release date until it's virtually on top of you.
Ubuntu: scheduled updates only require reboot for a new kernel
Windows 7: scheduled updates require reboot pretty-well every time they run.
Cheers,
- Mike
- 5
Albert Buendia http://www.slug.es | 10/21/2009 2:13:20 AM
As @3 said, you can not sell the product without screen shots. We live in a "photo world", :) Regards, Albert.
- 6
Henning Heinz | 10/21/2009 4:08:40 AM
I am always for good technology. Windows 7 works better than Windows Vista although compared to XP there is not much left if you take away the prettiness.
Domino Designer only runs on Windows, Traveller only runs on Windows, Gimp is not yet Photoshop and Symphony not Microsoft Office yet. I will use the platform that let me do my things in a reasonable amount of time at an acceptable cost (which definetely is more than free as in beer). If the software is good then I am happy paying for it. The Ubuntu Cloud collaboration Package solves problems that I do not have and would bring new problems that I cannot solve yet. Good if it works for others. By the way I have not had a virus on my Windows machine for years.
- 7
Darren http://www.dadams.co.uk | 10/21/2009 8:15:36 AM
I don't think Windows 7 should be under-estimated in terms of it's pull factor. I don't think I ever met a corporate customer with a plan to go to Vista, but I've spoken to several planning to deploy Windows 7... which surprises given that it's main attraction is, and I quote "it's an improvement on Vista". In it's own right that's not a very good reason.
It'll be interesting to see if the ol' double standards come into play. Very few, if any, customers upgrade to a x.0 release of Notes / Domino. Upgrading the whole desktop OS is potentially much more risky, so you'd expect everyone to wait for at least the first service pack. Time will tell...
- 8
Charles Robinson http://www.cubert.net | 10/21/2009 8:18:37 AM
I'm with Henning on this one. I'm a huge fan of Linux on servers, but Linux still isn't there yet for me as a desktop OS. Windows works for me and I find the cost acceptable for the functionality it offers.
@4 - At least get your terminology right, Windows is the target of *malware*. Actual viruses are rare these days. As for the rest... *sigh*.
- 9
Ferdy http://www.ferdychristant.com | 10/21/2009 1:13:26 PM
I'm all about choice, and have been using Linux as a server for years, much to my joy, and Linux as a desktop too, with much less joy.
(btw, I know the proper term is GNU/Linux and that Linux is not a desktop OS)
Despite this open attitude, I'm still finding comments like those made by Mike (@4) to be very black-and-white:
"Windows 7: huge system requirements"
Really? I'm using it on a 4 year old underpowered Dell desktop with 1GB of RAM and it flies. "Huge" is an exaggeration at the very least.
"Windows 7: Swiss-cheese security, added as an afterthought"
I agree that the security model of Linux is superior and designed from the start. Still, I too never had any virus on Windows in my entire computing life. But then again, I don't download from untrusted sources and I do not open attachments from emails in a private context. Furthermore, security has been substantially improved in Vista, and therefore also in 7.
"Ubuntu: No viruses to speak of"
Because nobody is using it?
(that was a joke)
"Ubuntu: zero purchase costs"
You can't argue with free. However, in the corporate world, the purchase cost of an OS is the least of their worries. It's the RUNNING costs that matter. Dozens of factors are involved for the running costs.
Don't get me wrong, I'm all for Ubuntu and the like gaining in market share and becoming a viable alternative. I have no reason to defend either Windows or Ubuntu. The only thing I'm defending is the truth as I see it. I think the Linux community has much to learn about what really matters for an OS.
- 10
tonyo | 10/21/2009 1:24:19 PM
@4 Mike, 6 years ago, I would have bet BIG money that Linux would have at least 20% desktop marketshare by now. ( as I was at IBM at the time) but now, after using Win7 our biggest competitor is Apple, not linux..
- 11
Ferdy http://www.ferdychristant.com | 10/21/2009 1:26:48 PM
Two more remarks that I forgot to make in my previous comment:
- 2000$ migration costs per user due to PC requirements...
This blows my mind. I can understand testing existing software on 7 could cost that much in a corporate environment, but new PC requirements? What new PC requirements? 7 uses roughly the same resources as XP.
- The chance of success for Ubunutu
Despite wishing the best for Ubuntu, I think they will never be a player in the corporate world. Sure, you will have a government or SMB giving it a try. They will go through the painful exercise explained by @2. Once done, they will realize that they have to work with other companies with other systems and other software. And what about mergers and acquisitions? What about the ecosystem of millions of Windows only software that runs businesses worldwide?
If you ask me, the only chance of success for breaking the OS dominance is the web. The faster the web evolves, the faster the OS becomes irrelevant. The only player who has this vision in their DNA, and has the resources to bring a substantial change is Google. Even for them it may take another 10 years (thereby for businesses 20 years) before there is a serious web alternative to the most important desktop apps.
Again, I'm writing this out of realism, not preference. My website shows an article written a few years back about how I completely switched to Ubuntu as a desktop. Guess what? I went back to Windows. I need to be productive, interoperable, and I need my software. An OS and a free office suite is not enough.
- 12
Mike Brown http://www.browniesblog.com | 10/21/2009 3:38:27 PM
@10 Tony,
Well, that was *your* prediction, not mine. Six years ago there was no Ubuntu and not even any Live CDs that I can recall. Ubuntu has made all the difference, and it's dragged the other distributions up around it. It may not be quite there yet, but it's pretty damned close.
- 13
mdmadph http://mdm-adph.blogspot.com | 10/21/2009 3:39:00 PM
@11 Ferdy
I don't know about you, but where I work, every time _anything_ is upgraded, it costs an ungodly amount of money just to retrain people. :P
$2000 total per person wouldn't surprise me.
- 14
Paulw | 10/21/2009 4:04:05 PM
@4 'Ubuntu: scheduled updates only require reboot for a new kernel'
No longer true - ksplice allows you to patch a running kernel without rebooting
{ Link }
- 15
Mike Brown http://www.browniesblog.com | 10/21/2009 4:40:33 PM
@10 Tony (again!),
"after using Win7 our biggest competitor is Apple, not linux"
They're both your competitors - Apple at the high end and Linux at the low end - and Microsoft is being crushed between them.
Linux is murdering Microsoft on netbooks. Sure, Windows has a much higher marketer share, but Microsoft is practically having to give XP away to maintain that share. Let's see how that one pans out with 7.
- 16
tonyo | 10/21/2009 5:29:14 PM
@15.. well, Win7 gets released this week. it will be interesting to look at the numbers 6 months from now. :)
- 17
Mike Brown http://www.browniesblog.com | 10/21/2009 7:55:18 PM
@16,
Speaking of "numbers". Tomorrow (later today, where I am) Microsoft releases its fiscal 2010 first quarter earnings.
The same day as the release of Windows 7. Now, isn't that a coincidence?
It will be very interesting to look at *those* numbers.
- 18
Ferdy http://www.ferdychristant.com | 10/22/2009 2:50:39 AM
@13: "I don't know about you, but where I work, every time _anything_ is upgraded, it costs an ungodly amount of money just to retrain people. :P"
I know, and I agree. But the article specifically mentions "due to new PC equipment", not due to training costs. If you need to buy a new PC to run Windows 7, you're probably in a situation where you needed to replace the hardware regardless of Windows 7.
- 19
MIke Brown http://www.browniesblog.com | 10/23/2009 7:13:44 PM
And the Q1 results for Microsoft are in. Oh dear. “Windows and Windows Live [revenue] fell from $4.28bn last year to $2.62bn.”
{ Link }
Yes, I know that there's a recession on and all that. But IBM and Google seem to be riding it out a tad better than this, don't they?
And Apple has just posted record profits. Maybe because their products are actually quite good?
Cheers,
- Mike
- 20
Nazeer Aval | 10/24/2009 3:17:42 PM
@ferdi...yes. Let me respond to your comments. Microsoft recommend new PC for 7 with recommended memory of 2 GB. Hope u had noticed that u cannot upgrade XP to 7. Hence huge cost involved in millions of XP machines. We have customers in Saudi w Ubuntu/Notes 8.5.1 in production and many evaluating. Its not only the running cost but what business value does it give to follow MS strategy of rip and replace by which customers are tired of.
good luck with that :) Windows 7 or Linux.. hmmmm tough decision.