Ed Brill

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1. 1  Olaf Boerner  | 11/10/2006 12:57:34 PM

   IBM should have acquired GOOD - this mobile mail technology must be bundled in the core Domino Server product.

   From end users perspective this is a MS Exchange advantage.

1. 2  Simon Barratt http://apps.fmc.com/blog.nsf | 11/10/2006 8:04:34 PM

   Totally agree with @1

1. 3  Pete McPhedran  | 11/10/2006 9:17:19 PM

   I don't agree, IBM should just keep doing what they are doing. Cooperating with the mobile manufacturers. If IBM bought Good, they would end up not supporting BlackBerries at all, RIM would drop support for Domino, because they are fierce rivals. Then you would see a huge jump to Exchange, as customers would have choice on that platform. Ironic.

   Exchange users could use Windows Mobile on smart phones, inluding Q, Razr, etc, (and at no additional cost btw) and/or BlackBerries wih the BES.

   Stick to the Messaging and Collaboration...

   --Pete

1. 4  Phil  | 11/10/2006 11:35:39 PM

   @3 I don't follow your logic. you're saying that IBM offering the same (or better) functionality in domino that MS does in Exchange (with regard to mobiles) would force people to choose Exchange?

1. 5  Phil  | 11/10/2006 11:38:31 PM

   ooops posted w/o email

1. 6  Charles Robinson http://cubert-codepoet.blogspot.com | 11/11/2006 12:48:32 AM

   I agree with Phil. Domino doesn't "support" Blackberries today, that integration is done by RIM. I don't recall the specifics, but Microsoft is offering mobile device support out of the box with Exchange 2007. IBM purchasing Good and offering similar integration would put them on a level playing field. Lotus is my messaging vendor, and I would like for my messaging vendor to provide an end to end solution. Lotus offers DAMO, why not DAWM (Domino Access for Windows Mobile) or DABB (Domino Access for BlackBerry)?

1. 7  Flemming Riis  | 11/11/2006 6:11:36 AM

   -I don't agree, IBM should just keep doing what they are doing. Cooperating with the mobile manufacturers. If IBM bought Good, they would end up not supporting BlackBerries at all, RIM would drop support for Domino, because they are fierce rivals.

   RIM wouldnt drop 50% of their market base for any reason.

   I think IBM should offer some resonable basic mobile support like Microsoft have for Exchange , no usuable sync out of the box in 2006 just isnt good enough.

1. 8  Rod Stauffer  | 11/11/2006 2:27:16 PM

   I can see Pete's point @3.

   As he said, Good and RIM are *fierce* rivals. Case in point, RIM settled last year with NTP even though none of NTP's patents stood up. The settlement was hundreds of millions, but RIM did it because of inroads competition with Good. Good was making headway with all the uncertainty (would RIM be shut down?).

   BTW, now that Good isn't privately held, how long until NTP targets them. They've recently sued Palm for patent infringement...

   >RIM wouldnt drop 50% of their market base for any reason.<

   Well, a number of Domino BES customers may well decide to switch to the "bundled" solution. Besides, we saw last year the impact of uncertainty in the mobile solution market. So that 50% would very likely shrink, affecting RIM investment in future versions. After all, how much do companies invest in shrinking business products?

   So I do agree that IBM buying Good wouldn't have been the best idea long term. A reduction in choice of mobile solution with Domino would be an ironic situation.

   That's not to say IBM couldn't build their own product. Granted, the "bundling effect" would still be there, but to a lesser extent. Even better, RIM and MotoGood would be on the same playing field and would continue to compete. Overall effect of IBM bringing another solution? Increased choice for the customer and a healthy third party environment. That sounds better than a Good acquistion would have been. In my opinion anyway, so I agree with the final point @8:

   >I think IBM should offer some reasonable basic mobile support like Microsoft have for Exchange , no useable sync out of the box in 2006 just isn't good enough.<

1. 9  Peter de Haas http://www.peterdehaas.net | 11/12/2006 5:24:53 AM

   @6

   "I don't recall the specifics, but Microsoft is offering mobile device support out of the box with Exchange 2007."

   The specifics are that Microsoft supports out-of-the-box email since *Exchange 2003*. SP2 of Exchange 2003 increased functionality with push email, administration and other more advanced features.

   Other Microsoft Servers such as CRM, Live Communications Server 2005, Microsoft Office SharePoint Server 2007 all support mobile access out-of-the-box.

1. 10  Olaf Boerner http://www.bcc.biz | 11/12/2006 5:28:42 AM

   The world is not black or white. We are living in a world of "coopetion" - companies are competing in some areas and are also working together in other areas.

   RIM has not and will not stop support for MS Exchange Customers since MS has introduced native Mobile Support. RIM even has provided software client for other competitors like NOKIA.

   RIM will continue the Lotus Notes marketplace.

   From the customers point of view the messaging vendor should provide basic mobile messaging support. If you need more advanced functionality you can choose 3rd party solutions like RIM, GOOD etc.

1. 11  Peter de Haas http://www.peterdehaas.net | 11/12/2006 12:42:25 PM

   @10

   "From the customers point of view the messaging vendor should provide basic mobile messaging support. If you need more advanced functionality you can choose 3rd party solutions like RIM, GOOD etc."

   Not sure what exactly you mean by 'more advanced functionality. Do you actually mean RIM is a more advanced platform compared to Windows Mobile ?

   From my point of view Good Technology has some advantages over RIM and that is that iit is less proprietary (works with Symbian, Windows Mobile devices). The disadvatage is that it adds cots (just like RIM) compared to Exchange which adds no cost and is also supported on Symbian and Windows Mobile devices ...

1. 12  Volker Weber http://vowe.net | 11/12/2006 12:46:54 PM

   "Do you actually mean RIM is a more advanced platform compared to Windows Mobile ?"

   Hands down, yes. And I am using both.

1. 13  Peter de Haas http://www.peterdehaas.net | 11/12/2006 1:27:42 PM

   @12

   Volker,

   Are you using both for more tham just email ? If so I actually disagree with you. Not because I work for Microsoft, but I've done quite some mobility projects in the past working for a large SI and never ever have I enabled mobile applications / integration to backoffice systems on a RIM device. RIM is good for email full stop

1. 14  Charles Robinson http://cubert-codepoet.blogspot.com | 11/12/2006 1:53:03 PM

   @9 - Thanks for the clarification. I don't use Exchange so I wasn't sure when it was added, but I knew it was in 2k7. Frankly I think Microsoft's approach makes the most sense. It gives customers a base level of functionality and if there is anything else they need they can go to a third party. I can appreciate IBM not wanting to tread too heavily into the territory of business and channel partners, but mobile integration is quickly becoming a core competency of any enterprise-grade messaging platform.

1. 15  Volker Weber http://vowe.net | 11/12/2006 2:00:25 PM

   Again I beg to differ.

   WM is like a one man band. Plays many instruments, but none of them right. The protocol is wasteful, presence is not handled in a goog way, the devices run down the battery too fast with ActiveSync. If you switch a Treo 750 from ActiveSync to Blackberry, it suddenly runs 4 days instead of hardly 2. As far as messaging is concerned, Blackberry is far advanced.

   MDS also seems to be pretty simple. Have you ever used that?

1. 16  Volker Weber http://vowe.net | 11/12/2006 2:03:08 PM

   Charles, I could not agree more. If you buy a mobile device today, you will (a) always have full connectivity at the client (Outlook) and (b) most like also at the server (Exchange). With rare exceptions, you get neither with Notes & Domino.

1. 17  Peter de Haas http://www.peterdehaas.net | 11/12/2006 2:16:31 PM

   @15

   MDS ? Not up to speed on my acronyms, sorry.

   Agree with you nythe way on RIM capabiities on the mobile email front wrt battery life / efficiency in this field.

   It does wonder me sometimes that Microsoft / device manufacturers took so long to catch up, but they do ...

   I don't have problems with battery life by the way. I don't use push email but sync every 30 minutes. I charge every time I'm in the car and this is at least 2 times a day for at least 1 hour. When travelling I charge via USB when needed when I use my tablet which is ... all the time :-)

1. 18  Volker Weber http://vowe.net | 11/12/2006 2:31:42 PM

   MDS is for backoffice integration: { Link }

   Re battery life: there is a huge difference whether you are using BB or MS protocols on the SAME device. MS is just missing a lot of infrastructure that BB provides. Transcoding proxies and attachment services, presence service.

1. 19  Peter de Haas http://www.peterdehaas.net | 11/12/2006 2:50:46 PM

   @18

   Never used MDS. To be honoust I do not know any RIM clients that do use their BlackBerries for anything other than email. A lot of ISV's support Windows Mobile in their offerings, some also BlackBerry.

   I do agree that "MS is just missing a lot of infrastructure that BB provides". This may be a disadvantage in some situations (battery life / protocol efficencÿ) but is an advantage in others. Cost of acquisition, cost of management for example.

1. 20  Flemming Riis  | 11/12/2006 2:51:50 PM

   - MS is just missing a lot of infrastructure that BB provides

   Sure , but activesync is pretty good for the cost of it.

   Microsoft is slowly adding features to mobility without having the user to buy 3rd party licenses.

   IBM could learn a bit from that imo.

1. 21  Sean Murphy  | 11/12/2006 4:03:23 PM

   Good never had an IPO. I don't think the venture capitalists were happy with that, especially after they hired all those silicon valley heavy hitters. Motorola must have bought them for a song and a dance. I would say all the talent at Good will jump ship. Rim is well established, and their stock has doubled since last November with the launch of the 8700, 4.0 server, reworked MDS and the SDK that works out of Eclipse.

   Motorola will have to work very hard to sell their next generation devices to the Fortune 500 who have already invested heavily in RIM software and devices.

1. 22  Keith Brooks http://kbmsg.blogspot.com | 11/12/2006 7:54:07 PM

   Having been in some discussions int he past with RIM, NOKIA, Ericsson and others my input would be Motorola will not get this right eitehr.

   Unless this is their 2007 strategy taking shape.

   RIM actually would make a better deal for IBM to buy, but price wise not likely.

   For starters their breakdown of the latest BES server and pieces was extremely reminiscent of how Domino is broken down into pieces.

   The have exfcellent patents which are licensed out to all handset makers and provide great revenue, even if no other blackberry is created.

   They are a tunr on the nail type of company. Sure they said they would never create a blackberry which had mp3 and photos, but hey we all say never sometimes.(look at all the ex-Lotus people at MS)

   Some serious competitive discussions would bounce good out of a deal, but from a DOmino perspective I must agree with many, IBM does not offer a good and simple out of the box way to perform similar functions.

   As a 3rd paryt the BES is fine.

   Nokia is interesting because they bought activesync and are trying for the 3rd time to capture a market they were unable to grab the first 2 times. This time they look to grab more hold. But Nokia loves Lotus and to be fair does have great handsets and more friendly UI than almost any other handset vendor.

1. 23  Mark Hughes  | 11/12/2006 9:31:13 PM

   @(19)

   We use BES MDS(Mobile Data Service) 4.1 and use it to connect to our Domino applications. It is very easy to create applications using web services in Domino 7. You can also deploy applications wirelessly to devices with no user interaction. You can disable a blackberry and delete all the data wirelessly from the server administrator. It is a great product for enterprise administrators.

1. 24  Pete McPhedran  | 11/13/2006 12:21:18 PM

   @4, sorry for the delay, been busy!

   What I am saying is if IBM bought Good Technology, they would be in a bad place. Good and RIM already squared off in court and Good's customers lost. Good *can not*, as in is not allowed to, support BlackBerry's. That's the deal.

   So IBM would be shooting itself in the foot buying a company that only support *some* of the handhelds and by far the smaller of the mobile market share that currently uses integrated wireless devices with Domino. No, I don't mean that RIM has sold more devices than all the cell manufacturers.

   If IBM bought Good, then RIM would be less incented to work as closely as they do with IBM to integrate with Domino. Would it stop, hell no. But let's say the cooperation (coopetition) isn't great and Domino starts to slip in the integration and features with new releases of BES. People would loose faith in the mail platform because it doesn't support all the devices the customer is using, WM, Smartphones and BlackBerry's.

   If that happened, all of a sudden Exchange would be more widely supported than Domino on wireless handheld devices. That's what would be ironic as MS is not world renowned for their diversity!

   IBM should build tools/products etc, to be able to embrace the devices, but buying Good wouldn't have been a successful way to accomplish that. I still say they should stick to messaging andcolaboration and work with the device manufacturers to allow them access. Like what they are doing now, with RIM and Good (A tiny little division of Motorola)

   BTW, don't kid yourself, RIM sells more BES servers to Exchage shops than Domino shops. A lot more. I figure it's becasue as other shave said, WinMobile is not quite ready for primetime, it's ok, but nothing even close to a BlackBeery experience. Including wireless access to applications using MDS (Mobile Data System). Lots of applications and more to come.

   --Pete

1. 25  Mike Lazar  | 11/13/2006 1:48:05 PM

   We provide MDS for the majority of our hosted BES customers. Once they are using them for internal mail, the next logical extension is for internal applications. The cost is minor compared to the overall service, and the power users/execs who live on their BBerries clamor for it.

   As for battery life, constantly charging your battery is a perfect way to cut its life by 75%. Batteries need to be drained a lot to keep optimal life. If you have to charge it every 2 days, that becomes a hassle.

1. 26  Drew Shobbrook  | 11/13/2006 4:54:59 PM

   I for one think IBM should get into the Mobile space, if not to compete with MS but now the new hand sets are rich clients capable of replacing the PC as we know it.

   IBM support of Linux shows that they can spend money to help us rid our selfs of the MS strangle hold on the computer market.

   The push email company that is Number 2 to RIM is Seven www.seven.com, they have over 100 carriers and over 500,000 users already using their software, they support Domino and 200 odd handsets, and even have a Java version of their software that could be ported to BB. MS is struggling to get the carriers to offer their solution, and due to the lack of support it is costing MS. Seven has looked after carriers by offering great support and been smaller able to fix their software when the problem arise. So if IBM is going to buy into this area... Seven.

1. 27  Paul Robichaux http://www.robichaux.net/blog | 11/13/2006 9:11:15 PM

   @26: one of the best things about the MS mobile mail stack is that you don't *have* to get the carrier to support it. If your carrier supports end-to-end IP, you can use Windows Mobile Direct Push to talk to an Exchange server, period. It's just HTTPS. No third-party NOC, no special-purpose data network, no separate server-side software to buy. If Seven has 500K users, that puts them well behind both MS and Good in terms of user counts.

1. 28  Richard Moy  | 11/21/2006 10:03:22 AM

   The Q is a cute product and I thought Motorola had finally fixed some of their quality problems so I recommended it for one of my clients. However, the units were so bad and buggy they got units replaced for free twice. I personally will never recommend it for my customers again. From my experience with Motorola products they tend to be buggy and incomplete and again they disappoint me. If Motorola plans to be in the business space they better improve their product quality. I switched myself to RIM and the quality is definitely better.

1. 29  Jeff  | 1/8/2007 9:36:37 AM

   @8

   >BTW, now that Good isn't privately held, how long until NTP targets them. They've recently sued Palm for patent infringement...

   Good signed a license agreement with NTP, so I am assuming that asset will transfer with Good to Moto